Thursday, July 25, 2013

Christopher aka Chris Bennetts Stalker Terrorist.Part1

Christopher aka Chris Bennetts Stalker Terrorist and 3 of his partners have written a "book" about a "treatment" against the internet stalkers, what to do and how to avoid them. 

It's about a few pages in PDF format to download for the price of 29 Dollars, down from 89 they were asking initially.
The authors of the "book" appear to be Christopher Bennetts, Perry Gamsby, Guenther Vomberg who said he translated the book in German language (No where to be found on the net) but he's acting also as an affiliate paid a commission  from the sales generated from his (Guenther's) web sites. 

But me, Evan Iliadis, I'm here today to tell my side of the story and save you some money. I'll tell you upfront with no detour and run around, but straight to the point: That the "book" is a rip-off consisting to steal your first subscription money, then will slowly rip you off much more using a subtle setup scam to lure you in more expenses, like designing a good image (yours) building web site, "investigation" fees to track your "stalker" fees for reporting and removing negative things posted about you and much more.

I will now direct you to another site where you can read more details about the scam, so I will continue in bringing you some information about the main author of the book  Christopher aka Chris Bennetts Stalker Terrorist.

Christopher aka Chris Bennetts Stalker Terrorist, is known in  Cebu Philippines and throughout S/E as one of the cruelest porn site developer on line targeting the wallet of psychopaths and disturbed clients.

I'm here today to tell the world, that Christopher Bennetts is a terrorist, a dangerous stalker capable of everything to humiliate his victims, with some others of the same, participated in the stalking, humiliation, violence against a couple in Cebu, the girl happened to be his ex-companion and the mother of his child, the guy his best friend who happened to be chosen by his girlfriend as a better man that he (Bennetts) is.

Let's get started and let the court document tell the story. 

Introducing Robelyn Bandejas "aka" Ruby 

Christopher aka Chris Bennetts Stalker Terrorist.Part1
Christopher aka Chris Bennetts Stalker Terrorist.Part1 Ruby Bandejas

Here is what she had to say for being a victim of this psychopath. I will put first a few excerpts of her affidavit she signed in her filing of charges against this predator, then I will post the entire text of the complaint. Click on the images below to enlarge them.


Christopher aka Chris Bennetts Stalker Terrorist.Part1
Christopher aka Chris Bennetts Stalker Terrorist.

Republic of the Philippines 
City of Lapu Lapu 

COMPLAINT AFFIDAVIT
I ROBELYN BANDEJAS, of legal age,Filipino,single with address 
at Gun-ob, Lapu-Lapu city, Philippines, after being duly sworn to in 
Accordance with law, hereby depose and state:

1. Thai 1 have a child with my former boyfriend, Christopher
Andrew Bennetts, named Rex Andrew Bennetts, who was born
on December 27, 2007 in Lapu-Lapu City as evidenced by a
copy of Rex Andrew Bennetts' Certificate of Live Birth attached

hereto as Annex *A*;

Christopher aka Chris Bennetts Stalker Terrorist.Part1



4. That the failure of Christopher Andrew Bennetts to provide the necessary financial support for my child had prompted me to seek the assistance of a lawyer who wrote to him a demand letter dated August 15. 2O08. A copy of the said demand letters attached hereto as Annex * B



 Christopher aka Chris Bennetts Stalker Terrorist.Part1
Christopher aka Chris Bennetts Stalker Terrorist.Part1




On August 4. 2008 at around 6:30 in the evening, when Mr.
Bennetts went to my rented apartment al Oun-ob, Lapu LapuCity and barged into the same against my will, Mr Bennetts then smashed my appliances and berated me; this incident was duly reported to the police as evidenced by a copy of the police blotter attached hereto a Annex D. The pictures showing the damage caused by Mr Bennetts are also attached hereto as Annexes *E* and "E-1", respectively;



Christopher aka Chris Bennetts Stalker Terrorist.Part1
Christopher aka Chris Bennetts Stalker Terrorist.Part1



9 . That on October 27, 2008 at around 11 o'clock in the evening, again Mr. Christopher Bennetts showed his propensity to cause humiliation and more emotional distress on my part by again following me and my fiancee. Dean Boyd Marston, at MBlsTavern in Haute Kafudoy Lapu Lapu City, this was done by Mr. Bennetts by hiring a person on board a motorcycle with plate number OV 8062 who went inside MB's Tavern to verify me and my fiancee's presence there and upon confirming our presence, the unknown person on board the said motorcycle informed Mr. Bennetts through text message of our presence and waited outside MB* Tavern, since we became auspicious because of the prior incident on August 4. 2006, I and my fiancee together with the owner of MBS Tavern. Mrs. Martene Effelberger, decided to leave the place on board Mrs Effelberger's Toyota Hi-Lux, however, before we could go away from the place, a red multicab with plate number YDK 332 driven by a certain Paul, an American National, together with Christopher Bennetts and the former's girlfriend, came speeding down Kagudoy road and blocked the way of the Toyota Hi-Lux; Mr. Bennetts and company then went on harassing us by banging on the windows of the Toyota Hi-Lux and making intimidating and threatening gestures; to buttress my claim, MarleneEffelberger's affidavit is attached hereto as Annex "F";



Christopher aka Chris Bennetts Stalker Terrorist.Part1
Christopher aka Chris Bennetts Stalker Terrorist.Part1



10. Christopher Bennetts even went to the extent of yelling at us in the following words, to quote: "Be careful! I know where you fucking live". This was blatantly done by Mr. Christopher Bennetts in front of so many people including about 20 staff or personnel of MB's Tavern, and as if not satisfied with what they have done, they further yelled defamatory remarks by charging and yelling that Mr. Marston victimized minor girls in Bogp City,
Cebu; the same incident was also reported to the police as reflected in two separate police blotters attached hereto as Annexes "G»" and *M*. respectively.


Readers, I think you have already enough to judge if the author of "a book" on cyberstalking is a stalker himself that physically stalking, humiliating, insulting and beating women.  
I will continue the rest of the affidavit in the next entry, then a new page will be created for the original court documents. 



Wednesday, May 8, 2013

Evan Iliadis. Stop Internet predators


Stop Internet predators

Stop Internet predators

As our daily live have merged in the computer technology where we are connected through Iphone, Ipads, laptop, computers, webpages, emails and Text messaging in about every aspect of our lives, there has emerged a group of criminals, con artist, predators and scammers bent on using this technology for the soul reason to steal our hard earned money and assets from us. 

These criminals have invaded every aspect of the internet and will use any and every means to try and ensnare a victim and steal as much money from them as possible even to the determent of the life and health of their target.

They are very often evade the consequances of their criminal actions by concealing their real identity, or when they don't they do create a parallel profile portaying themselves as cirizens in good standing by publishing on the internet businesses they know nothing about, they have never owned one, is just a facade hiding other indecent business they relying living upon.

Evan Iliadis, (me) the author of this blog and many others is investigating them for nearly 5 years now in one of the hot spots of sexpats' and scammers' destination from throughout the world, in the S/E Asia, The Philippines. 
The country Evan Iliadis has explored for living there 5 years, this country where people will smile at you, as nice or rude you foreigner can be, the country where people will call you "Sir" even you are a Vietnam war era drunkard, arrogant, most likely a worthless expat.

In turn,all you bringing  to the Philippines is just that. A corrupted life style that often fits in a certain class of the Philippines society. Like local pimps and scammers they will run to be your associates. 

I
t al  started the year 2009 in a Yahoo Group (now defunct) owned by an American living in Cagayan De Oro Mindanao Philippines under the name of Gordon Eletson AKA Texkano for Texas USA.
Right_Minded-Winged_Warriors. Not many members, about 50 but you could find La creme de La creme of the US veterans and others posting this kind of messages: (Click on the image to enlarge it)


Stop Internet predators


Always giving fantasist signatures like "John Wayne" Jim Carter" and many others. 


In this thread, Pottbelly 2000 refers to an argument he had with Paul Petrea, of course he was there, a "hero" member, the place where me and him had several "conversations" as well. Like this one below writing under the screen name "Noel".  (Click on the image to enlarge it)

Stop Internet predators


Inevitably the showdown began. Post after post,thread after thread, pages and pages filled with nasty exchanges of comments, personally having one thing in my agenda: Shut this group down. With the help of few others this happened a few months later. more on this here. It worth revisiting the topic. I good guide of do's a don'ts in the Philippines.

The forum mentioned above was the beginning of a long crusade against the expat and sexpat migrating to the Philippines by "Airplanes, boats, busses... and trains". I realized that everything was planed and advertised on the forums owned by foreigners for the purpose of attracting others of their specie; They needed to enlarge their community for several reasons, all suspect and not in the interest of the Philippines or my wife's Filipino family.

Gordon Eletson was living on meager retirement of $600 a month with a  complemental income of an "introduction service" trying to sell mail brides through a blog he had linked to his forum. All pictures have been deleted, many were underage.

Paul Petrea, a member of the forum was maintaining (still does)  a forum on his own of about the same style for the purpose of scamming his members and members of other forums as well.

Perry Gamsby  An e-writer selling books on the internet about Philippines. Rather defamatory, sarcastic for a husband of a Filipino woman.

Christopher Bennetts AKA Chris Bennetts An Australian Citizen Living in Cebu Philippines

Those and many others will be introduced to you prospective visitor to the Philippines, to you expat you already live there, to you Filipinos so you know who this "Sir" living near you is may be one of them.

Once you read all that you'll know why so many sexpats and criminals hate me in the Philippines. They don't like me! They want the net exclusively for them ! When some one unmask them they report "the disturbance" to Google… But Google know how to make the difference between spammers and good people fighting the evil…








Thursday, November 1, 2012

Loving Thy Neighbor

From the the Philippine Rotary official magazine :

Two brothers, Poping and Pedro Tamboli, were born into a family of seven. The entire family was learning disabled. While they were young, the family unit fell apart. So at an early age they found themselves on their own. Being strong, a local land baron took advantage of them and their disability by offering them work for food and a place to sleep. As they grew old, their bodies and minds began to fail them, and they became a burden. The land baron had no further use for them and forced them off the farm. Their lives were shattered. They wandered around their little island, seeking food and shelter. The community shunned them. The children mocked them and a town official made fun of them.


Evan Iliadis neighbors in Songculan
During the day, they begged for food and at night they sought shelter in the local church. Soon the church locked their doors at night, leaving the brothers out in the weather.

Evan Ilialis, a Rotary member from RC Tagbilaran, had been helping a 79-year-old widow by the name of Mrs. Sing Bulawin, with weekly deliveries of groceries. She is severely hunchbacked and lives in a modest nipa hut in the town near the farm. Her only source of income is an allowance which her daughter sends to her every month from Manila. One day when Evan was delivering groceries to Mrs. Bulawin, he noticed two old men sleeping on the ground under her house. On asking her who they were, Sing, as she likes to be called, replied, two men needing some food. Although her provisions were small, she had taken pity on the two retarded strangers, and had decided to share her food with them.

Evan was touched by the old ladys compassion. That afternoon, Evan attended the Tagbilaran Rotary meeting, and told of his discovery. The Club Community Service Director Dave Collins and Jack Galbreath went with Evan to Sings house immediately after the meeting, with a substantial supply of food. Mrs. Bulawin was shocked. She could not believe that there were people in the world who still cared about the elderly, and began to cry.
 Mrs. Bulawin, no longer has to worry about food provisions. She, Poping and Pedro, are being helped by one of ten programs under the Adopt a Village umbrella. It is called Home Care Assistance. Every week, Rotarian Evan stops by with provisions and to tend to any other needs that the elderly may have.

Thrilled? No my friends. My neighbors never received as much from the Rotary as they received by my family. It was all for the picture. Like this one above. Take it,circulate it around the clubs, look what we are doing, open your wallet and give us a donation. We guarantee it, only 10% of your donation will go where is due, the rest will be available for when you the donor come to the Philippines. We'll entertain you!



Sunday, September 23, 2012

Memories of a former Rotarian and Human trafficking activist

Memories of a former Rotarian and Human trafficking activist Philippines years 2000 – 2007



Sick and tired of all those “philanthropists” begging us for money for the “poor children in the third world”! They are all over the web, in the streets, malls, airports, PP presentations in Rotary and other clubs and associations and I’m sure I missed many!. How much of this money will actually reach the destination intended?
Dear reader, is not the first time you are reading this. You’ve heard before about crooks in the charity business, don’t you? Is it fair to say they are nothing else but a bunch of criminals pocketing 90% of the donation with the remaining 10% they actually spent was just for the picture and clips in the you-tube.
 Memories of a former Rotarian and Human trafficking activist
Evan iliadis: Memories of a former Rotarian 
and Human trafficking activist
Many come from Churches created by evils and atheists, or individuals within “above suspicion community service organizations with names like “children this and children that, SOS! in danger! starving! etcaccompanied with dramatic pictures like they informing us of something we didn’t already know”
But lately, the Rotary International is also being used (and abused) by Rotarians covering their “philanthropic” activities in the most subtle and hard to detect scams, unless you are one of those initiated with good observances skills but playing the stupid and idiot to avoid suspicion.
To be a whistle blower it takes a rare courage that not many possess. In the end, the whistle blower is the one with the most integrity, and I’d like to think, the one you would want most for the job. While whistle blowing can get you in a lot of hot water, it is something I like to think I would dare to do. When I see wrongs, it bothers me – a lot, and after praying about it, if I feel whistle blowing is the only (or the best) option, I would probably do it. It’s a matter of integrity in a world where so many are cutting corners and doing whatever it takes to up the bottom line.
The repercussions of whistle blowing will probably not be life-threatening, but the repercussions of not whistle blowing when it’s called for can destroy your peace of mind. Money and jobs are important, but peace of mind is even more important. So, blow that whistle baby, and let the chips fall where they may. You will be the better person for it.
The purpose of this blog is not only to alert Rotarians and others around the world contributing to the VILLAGE AIDE PROGRAM (VAP) with donations and/or volunteer work. In this blog, EVAN ILIADIS a former Rotarian and manager of the VAP in the Philippines will clearly explain the accusations against those who abused your money, with supporting documents in his possession, the real purpose of this organization, how it all started, and where it stands today. You’ll also learn how the distribution of the Matching Grants awarded by the ROTARY INTERNATIONAL around the world, actually mostly the third world, is implemented and who’s the real beneficiary of the “projects”

First, allow me to introduce myself. I’m former Rotarian EVAN ILIADIS a former member of the ROTARY CLUB OF TAGBILARAN (RCT for short) in the island of Bohol Philippines where I lived for 6 years forced to leave this country for medical reasons my whole family was at risk, including my youngest son 7 at the time  fighting severe asthma and tuberculosis.
From day one after my induction in March of 2004 I made service to the community a priority, a foul time none paid job serving children elderly and mentally retarded with funds provided by the VILLAGE AIDE PROGRAM (VAP for short) an organization based in Australia owned by Rotarian Derek Pyrah and his former family – former in the sense that he dumped them recently at the age of 62 and moved to the Philippines for the eyes of a 20 years young Filipino girl – funds sent to and managed by former Rotarian and PP of the RCT Dave Collins.
In august of 2007 I received the PHF award my club unanimously agreed I deserve, the cost of $1000 paid by the VAP, Thrilled? not at all!. I wish I had receive it from the hands of the president of the RCT in recognition for services rendered within the club and not- unknowingly- contributing to VAP’s crooked business.
Back in September 2007, as a member of the ROTARY CLUB OF TAGBILARAN (RCT for short) I filed a request with the club asking the president to investigate the then Rotarians Dave and Wilfida “aka” Baby Garcia Collins members of the said club the whereabouts of the following amounts of money
-5 Matching Grants (MG for short) approved and money wired by the TRF (The Rotary Foundation)  to a MB (Metro Bank)  account the custodians being David Collins and Deoscoro Uy  manager of the local MB branch, past president of the RCT and treasurer. The MG I was referring to are:
- RC Milton-Mowbray Matching Grant 2006                    P 800,000.00(Philippines pesos)
– RC Milton-Mowbray Matching Grant 2007                    P 950,000.00
– RC Collingwood Canada  Matching Grant 2007             P790,000.00
– RC Wilshire Blvd Hollywood Matching Grant 2007       P 900,000.00
– RC West Wollongong Matching Grant 2007                    P 902,739.95

-Thousands of US dollars received from donations given by clubs and Rotarians around the world that were never registered in the club’s accounting report as read in the regular meeting by the treasurer Deo Uy but instead were deposited to an MB account that only Collins and him (Deo) were custodians and knew the ins and outs of the money in violation of RI bylaws that every single dollar must be deposited in a club controlled bank account.
-10 millions pesos -Aprox. US$250,000.00 – received from the VILLAGE AIDE PROGRAM based in Australia as Baby Collins claimed on this banner the Club had no prior knowledge of any movement or a bank account under their control with such figures as posted outside her pawn shop downtown Tagbilaran City.
Memories of a former Rotarian and Human trafficking activist
Evan iliadis: Memories of a former Rotarian and Human trafficking activist


- A detailed cost and bidding documents for all construction projects financed by the RI as required under the terms and conditions of the TRF, including Waterless toilets water tanks and more, that instead was done by Dave Collins as a prime contractor employing his own workers in violation of the “conflict of interest” section as also described by the TRF bylaws.

-The RCT formed an investigative committee to handle the complain  but the Collins when ordered to show up on scheduled appointments to explain the accusations did not comply, instead they deserted the club preferring the status of fugitives rather than try to defend the defensible, they knew my allegations were concrete solid, fully backed with their own fingerprints on. At the same time, I notified the TRF about the fraud – the only word that perfectly fits – joining the necessary documentation to backup my allegations to the attention of Meredith Berliew and Collete Martin-Wilde, both Matching Grant supervisors – coordinators and Heather Fosburgh stewardship supervisor all 3 sitting in the RI headquarters in Evanston Illinois.

-At the time of my inquiry not all money was invested in the projects intended, they (Collins and Deo Uy  were asked to provide a foul accounting of the funds received and disclose where the unused money is. Baby Collins replied that they returned to the TRF 4 million pesos. (About 88 thousands US dollars) Not a single proof of it was given to the investigators.

Meanwhile, the TRF ordered Catherine King , a senior Matching Grant supervisor – coordinator for the SE Asia Rotary clubs to investigate my allegations. She cleared the RCT of any wrong doing indicating that the club can reapply for Matching Grants if they wish but when asked to provide information about the whereabouts of the 4 million pesos Collins claim they returned she has never replied.

-From a couple of hundred mails I received I chose two examples of typical comments that reflect many others. Both comments were written by American Rotarians. Does it make any difference?  It sure does. Their pragmatism is very often not well perceived by the rest of the world, especially in the third world because of  lack of sensitivity, understanding of other cultures, unless they spent time there.  “Bill’s” comment below is a typical example. And  “George” wants me to go “right on the money” – so to speak!
 Here is the first:

“I found your site interesting, especially as a brand new Rotarian. The only thing I’d question, without knowing ANY facts, is how much better would these people have been if the Rotarians had done NOTHING?”
Bill. (Not his real name)
Bill, not many will agree with your approach of doing charity work. If you are cheating with the IRS paying 100 dollars taxes instead of 1000 that your earnings show you owe, should the first be grateful to you that you paid 100 instead of nothing? The issue here is what their motivations were of “helping” the poor, how much money they received and how much they invested. Should we be grateful to them – the persons named above and below- that they are asking for a donation of a dollar to feed a hungry claiming that 97% is making it to the site but instead when you open this bag and count it contains only 20 cents of food? I have distributed hundreds and know what I am talking about!..  So, to your opinion (and philosophy) we should applaud them for giving 20 cents instead of the 97% of what they said they were giving? Click and scroll to see the highlighted portions. He claims here (And in several other documents in my possession) that the admin cost is only 2.3%. to pay for his travel expenses and accommodations from Australia to the Philippines 5 times a year, numerous guests from AU, RI officials, board members his ex wife for travel and accommodation expenses all paid by a 2.3% budget froman annual income of $100,00.00 as Derek Pyrah claims here? I’ll leave the answer to the readers.

-The second mail came from a respected long time Rotarian with a long and honorable record in the org. Let’s name him “George” He wrote: 
“If it is about money, be specific as to how the money actually flowed, and how it should have flowed. You don’t need much more than that”.
Request granted “George”. Even though I have described often of what I am accusing them let’s do it one more time in simple words, straight to the point. I’m accusing them for the following:
  1. Of defrauding Individuals, Rotarians, Clubs and organizations in Australia and elsewhere in the world  where the VAP leaders Derek Pyrah and Dave Collins mislead donors to contribute by misrepresenting their actions. An example  of this accusation can be seen by clicking here.They instructed donors to deposit money not in a RCT Club controlled bank account but on one they (Collins and treasurer PP Deo Dioscoro) had absolute control, the club having total ignorance of the existence of such account. Remember, Deo Dioscoro is the manager of the MeTRO BANK where the accounts were held. This is just an example. If interested you can read more inside this blog
  2. Of defrauding TRF of thousands of dollars by misrepresenting the use of the MG as follows: Dave Collins did not disclose to the foundation that he was the contractor-builder of all construction projects submitted for financing, instead he claimed that it was a construction company under the name of VALLES CONSTRUCTION in Tagbilaran Bohol that was hired for the job. There isn’t such company under this name in the TRADES AND INDUSTRY DEPARTMENT data base in Bohol. Here is the document proving my allegation:Click here to see a mail sent to many with the report attached.
  3. Most important, the report is here

 In virtue of what should  I exclude the fact that all medication purchased  did not reach the destination, free distribution to the poor that is, but instead were diverted to the shelves of his wife’s pharmacy for sale? Baby Collins is best known for her passion of changing her cell-phone weekly making sure she always uses the latest model and her European made wardrobe than her compassion for the poor… No one ever controlled the purchase and even less the destination.
They are claiming: “Oh yes! We have receipts!” What receipts? They are all in the name of her Pharmacy, together of what she buys for her business and for the Rotary. Any one has seen anything? Please, raise your hand…-

-Once I filled a request with my club  for opening an investigation as described above, the President formed an investigative committee to explore the allegations. They agreed with the Collins and PP Dioscoro on a number of meetings for discussion and were ordered to submit to the club the bank accounts “pass books” as they called in the Philippines the saving accounts booklets where all transactions are recorded. (I was wondering why they had not a checking account?). They refused, they disappeared, never attended investigation meetings neither regular meetings.“George, do you know any innocent behaving this way? If my allegations as submitted to the club AND to the RI were driven by malice due to a personal vendetta it would be easy for such powerful people to defeat them right on the start. Instead they felt comfortable under the fugitive’s blanket rather than take the time to explain.” 

-The RI and the DG have been informed about the facts long time ago . Their inaction to this matter resulted not only to a “let it go” but encouraged them – the accused- to further accented an already ill and predatory behavior towards the local Rotary community. The RI has read this story here before. Take a look and let me know if this is relevant to the RI or not. If the last can’t find any wrong doing, then, they will have to review their members attitude policies , morals and interpretation of what misbehavior is all about. Their inaction to this matter-again- was taken for granted by the accused and went out of control by harassing any one on their way. like asking the 


DG of district 3860 to order the closure of the RCT,
When he said NO! they filled Libel charges against the PP Luela Bantol who was President during the events. And get this: Libel laws in the Philippines allow the complainant to file a Criminal or Civil case or both. They chose to file only civil charges asking 500K pesos each of the 3 complainants = about $10K- for damages. A fortune by Philippines cost of living standard. Yes George! right on the money! Do you know any judge in the world that has sentenced a Rotary President of doing her job? Consisting of canceling their membership for non payment of their dues and non attendance to the regular meetings for more than 6 months? Talk about misbehavior.. Harassment! harassment! harassment !… isn’t it?

Finally this: This blog goes on now for more than a year, the same, or almost, facts are repeated over and again. Is this serving a purpose anymore? Yes and no. If it’s the money aspect George you are more concerned is not an issue anymore, The money is gone, vanished, no one will ever be punished, this blog won’t bring it back.After all as I wrote before it was just ….Rotary money… Now it’s all about misbehavior. This has caused more harm than the embezzling the money did.

Time has been kind to Collins. The club did not file any criminal charges against them as it should and they had plenty to go for. Instead, they chose to ignore them, happy to regain control of their club, finally! peace and order prevailed. They were hoping they (Collins) will leave them alone in their difficult task to rebuild club’s reputation and expanding membership, they were doing a great job on both areas.Dave Collins, Derek Pyrah,John Van Laar and a few others had a different agenda.

This blog will go on in the same way and style as it started. I want to let know the gerontocracy governing the Rotary- in an obsolete way for now days – that I’m not expecting their sympathy or changes in their way of unmasking crooks and criminals within the Rotary – as limited their number may be. Dave Collins has been the cruelest defamator to Rotarians and others, he squeezed the funds from his club, go unpunished, now he’s filling libel charges against the president trying to extort money from her. All these under the total indifference of the RI pressured by some top guns as high as DGs and PDGs each of them for different reasons, including some are owners of a charity business themselves.